Belonging Project Podcast

Fiorenza Rossini (00:52)
Today, I am sitting down with Hannah Douglas. Hi Hannah, how are you?

Hannah Douglas (00:57)
I’m good, thank you. How are you?

Fiorenza Rossini (00:58)
I’m well, thank you. Right, you are a mum and you’re also an actress, an award-winning actress, actually. And you’ve also launched your LoudHer Voice.

So that is quite a few things, quite a few hats there for you.

How did you start your business? What was the catalyst for that,

Hannah Douglas (01:21)
Yeah, so I, yes, obviously I’ve, I’ve, I trained as an actress and have worked as an actress my whole life. And, and then after I became a mum, I was talking to so many different women and, you know, mainly mums who were feeling like they kind of weren’t heard properly at work or were nervous about going back to work or just

sort of had this sense of feeling like didn’t quite know what their voices were anymore. And I really felt that kind of sense of identity shift as well. You know, when I became a mum, before I had Leo, I thought, you know, when he’s six months old up, I’ll totally be fine. I could go out, I can go and work, I can do this, be fine.

And I really didn’t feel like that at all and felt the complete opposite and just didn’t want to be away from him at all. So that was a real shock to the system because work had always been my passion. It had always been like everything to me. And so it was kind of a lot to shift my priorities and my perspective on things. And motherhood really does that for you.

So, yeah, so I basically took everything that I’ve kind of known from acting and my experience there. And I decided a few people had spoken to me about doing public speaking before. And I’d always kind of been interested in it, but wasn’t quite sure in what capacity. And then the idea of kind of doing it with more of a focus on women felt a lot more exciting to me.

So I decided to launch Loudher and it all kind of happened quite quickly actually. Yeah, once I kind of had the idea, it happened quite quickly and seemed like it was actually something that people were calling for and were interested in. And so it’s been growing from there really.

Fiorenza Rossini (03:12)
Fantastic. And so how is LoudHer helping people, women?

Hannah Douglas (03:17)
So it’s public speaking and voice coaching, mainly for women. And I do one, either one-to-one sessions, group sessions or corporate sessions. And I use actor-based tools and training to talk about things like the breath and voice and confidence and how they’re all connected. And I’d say it’s quite a holistic approach. It’s not your…

average or old fashioned kind of power pose. Here’s how you use a big voice and here’s how you kind of dominate people public speaking training. It’s more about getting people to recognise how everything in life affects your breath and your voice and therefore your confidence and that there are tools and exercises that you can use to remedy that.

and to feel like you can be heard in your voice and not somebody else’s.

Fiorenza Rossini (04:09)
And we touched on confidence a little bit. feel like a lack of confidence or feeling, a feeling that we lack confidence is often what might

bring people to seek help and support with their public speaking or with feeling that they have a voice, they’re being heard and they can step into that. I’m speaking and I have my seat at the table. what’s your opinion on

confident? Do you think that it’s something that we built, that we built over time? Or is it something that we kind of have and perhaps at some point we’ve unlearned it, if that makes sense?

Hannah Douglas (04:50)
think it’s actually a mixture of both. think that confidence is really deep rooted. And I think that it’s, you know, if you look at kids playing like little, little, like two year olds playing, they don’t have any kind of self awareness. They don’t have any inhibitions. just sound how they sound. They move how they move because they haven’t had that kind of

those experiences in life that make you sort of shrink. I was confident as a kid and actually when I became a teenager, I lost loads of confidence because I think because I’d been like the musical theatre kid who loved performing, I then kind of was labeled as maybe being a bit too much or a bit too full of myself. So I completely shrank.

and decided that I didn’t want to be like that anymore. So interestingly, throughout my career as an actor, I actually never liked speaking in public as myself because I like being a character. I didn’t like being myself. So I had to do quite a lot of digging to figure out where that had come from. So I think that it is something that we can, that I do think it’s something that’s in us. And then our life experiences determine kind of

whether that stays. But I think it is something that we can build back up. And I think that it’s so connected to the breath, the breath and confidence just go hand in hand. Because I think when your confidence is knocked or when trauma happens to you, we shut that breath off, because we don’t want to feel certain things. And then that has an impact because then your body kind of tenses up and your voice can’t flow.

And then we get less confidence because we feel like our voice isn’t being heard. Whereas actually if we can do some of these tools where we can get that breath dropped and we can encourage our body to feel open, then that can then have a positive impact on your confidence because you start to realize that actually, I do have the tools. And if I do these breathing exercises before a meeting,

actually I did feel slightly less nervous. So then it can, it can build back up.

Fiorenza Rossini (06:52)
So it’s a journey really. It’s not gonna be an overnight switch.

Hannah Douglas (06:56)
Wouldn’t that be nice

if it was? Yeah, I’d be so rich if I could just sell a little pill that makes you really confident.

Fiorenza Rossini (06:59)
I wish.

Do you find that people come to you and that’s what they expect?

Hannah Douglas (07:11)
Not as much as I thought, actually. I’ve actually had a little bit of the opposite. So I think I had people who thought that certain things would take a really, really, really long time. And actually in one session, they found tools that helped them more quickly and more immediately. But no, I haven’t had so much of people just going, make me be confident now. I think.

I think because it’s so deep rooted, I think it’s more common for people to think, God, I’m never gonna feel confident. I’m never gonna feel like I can do this. I suppose the only thing I have had is people who want to work on specific presentations. We look at things that they can use very, very quickly. For example, one girl had a big presentation the next day. So it was kind of trying to find things that were.

going to help her immediately, but still letting her know and kind of making it clear that this work does take a bit more time. Yeah.

Fiorenza Rossini (08:07)
Yeah, talking about work presentations, makes me think of comments that I’ve heard quite a few times actually, professionals mentioning that they think they have their work voice.

that actually doesn’t quite sound like their voice in normal life at home with their friends. Is that something you hear as well? What’s your take on this?

Hannah Douglas (08:29)
Yeah,

totally. There’s a lot of people who say they have a kind of, it was always called a telephone voice in the past, they would put on a bit of a posh voice on the telephone. And I suppose it kind of comes from that. I think a lot of people feel one of two things, either they feel that they change their accent slightly or they change their tone for work purposes.

Fiorenza Rossini (08:36)
you

Hannah Douglas (08:56)
Or they feel like in a work environment, their voice completely shrinks and holds back and they feel a lot less confident than they would maybe if they were kind of with their friends or their family or people that they felt comfortable with. So yeah, it’s quite common for people to feel like their voice changes.

Fiorenza Rossini (09:14)
Well, that’s reassuring. For anyone listening to this, this is reassuring. And I think we also hear about, you know, if you’re a good public speaker, you sound polished. Is that true? Do you have to? I mean, I don’t think so, but what do you think?

Hannah Douglas (09:17)
Yeah.

I don’t, I don’t,

think that there’s, God, I mean, I think I could probably speak for about an hour just on this. I think that the expectation to be perfect is what is so damaging to confidence and is what makes people not speak. I think that if you are talking about a subject that is passionate, that you’re passionate about,

we will listen because if you’re interested in it, we will be engaged. I think that there are tools that you can use that help you sound more polished. Polished is probably the wrong word, help you sound more grounded. For example, I think a lot of us rush because we just want to get everything out there and then shrink back into our hole so that no one’s looking at us anymore.

Fiorenza Rossini (10:15)
I’m done.

Hannah Douglas (10:16)
Okay, goodbye.

And I think a lot of us, when we have finished, especially women, we often apologize for ourselves or kind of do that thing with you. Yeah, so yeah, anyway. Yeah, yeah, that’s me. And so I think there are little things that you can do, breathing exercises that help you with brushing that help you.

with that confidence to be able to stop when you finished your sentence. Simple public speaking tools that can help you sound more grounded. But I don’t think it matters what your accent is. I don’t think it matters where you come from. I don’t think it matters what your personality is. I think, you know, especially in this world of AI, I think what people really enjoy about a speaker.

is seeing a little bit of them and something that we can relate to. I think that’s the most important thing.

Fiorenza Rossini (11:07)
We want to make sure we have a human in front of us. You’ve mentioned that there are a few tools that help in getting more grounded. What’s your favorite tool or the one that you end up recommending the most?

Hannah Douglas (11:20)
Again, so everything comes back to the breath. So I think if I could give somebody one tool to use just before speaking, it would be either sitting or standing somewhere where you can really feel your feet on the floor, making sure that your knees and your shoulders are relaxed. yeah, so not slumps, but also not…

so kind of upright that you’re causing tension and then putting one hand on your chest, one hand on your belly and doing a breathing exercise called balloon breathing. So you breathe in through your nose and you think about a balloon expanding in your belly and your ribs and then you blow out on a

like a F sound and you imagine that balloon deflating, like you’re squeezing every single bit of air out and then you let that breath back in again. So if you do three to five rounds of that, usually you start to feel your nerves dissipating slightly. You start to feel your mind becoming a bit clearer and you feel a bit more grounded because you can really feel the floor on your feet. But

any sort of simple breathing exercise that just gets you in your body rather than your mind is going to be good.

Fiorenza Rossini (12:27)
Yeah, I love this tool actually. And I think it’s really helpful in getting us to work with our nerves instead of trying to make them disappear.

Hannah Douglas (12:35)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, Nerves can be a really good thing. I read someone said, I think I shared a post recently that said they imagined that kind of slightly panicky heartbeat feeling as being an inner applause. And I loved that idea of just shifting your mindset slightly of going because it’s the same comes from the same place as excitement. My partner is really

scared of roller coasters. And he was in the queue and he decided to do an experiment and he was feeling really nervous. And he was like, I’m just going to tell myself I’m excited. I’m just going to keep saying, I’m so, I’m so excited for this. I’m so excited. Really, really looking forward to it. And actually he did. He enjoyed it way more. So I think sometimes it’s, it’s shifting that mindset to go, okay, I feel nervous. That’s normal. And

It’s also because I care about this and because I’m excited. So let’s find a way to use it rather than make it take over.

Fiorenza Rossini (13:36)
well, I’m definitely going to try this balloon breathing activity. I right now use something more simple. So I’m very keen to explore that,

My breast has let me down once. I’m going to tell you the story. It was actually when I was pregnant with my son. So yeah, a more than six years ago, I was very pregnant at the time, still working in corporate. It was towards the end of the pregnancy. And I, you know, the pregnancy was going great and I didn’t have any kind of, you know, breath.

Hannah Douglas (14:05)
Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (14:11)
breathing symptoms or anything like that. So I was relying on my breath to be as usual.

Hannah Douglas (14:17)
Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (14:18)
And then I was about to give this presentation and I started, but then something went weird with my breath. And I think it was a combination of, yes, I was having my usual nerves, but probably with the stress that the pregnancy was putting on my body and my breathing, it just…

Hannah Douglas (14:32)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (14:41)
It didn’t work as it would normally. And I was like, what’s going on? Like, I can’t speak. And it didn’t happen to me again, thankfully. But when I was pregnant with my second,

Hannah Douglas (14:43)
Yeah.

I was afraid.

Fiorenza Rossini (14:54)
I was a little bit scared it would happen again. So I was really trying to give myself more time when I was speaking and not trying to rush. ⁓

Hannah Douglas (15:00)
Yeah. It’s best thing to do. I mean,

this is where it comes from, right? Like, most people’s fear of public speaking is because at some point we’ve had an experience that’s made you go, my God, I never want that to happen again. And it could be something very, very small, or it could be something that’s like, you know, as an actor, completely forgetting your lines on stage and completely blanking.

it’s going to have an effect and it’s going to make you a bit nervous. But you did the right thing, slowing down, giving yourself more time is gold. I think people often feel like they need to rush. But actually giving yourself that space to breathe is brilliant. And it’s so interesting because maybe it was your body being like, hang on, you’re not supposed to be concentrating on this.

Fiorenza Rossini (15:46)
Maybe.

Hannah Douglas (15:51)
I was going to say quickly with the balloon breathing as well. The reason why it’s really great is because I think a lot of people think with deep breathing, you’re just imagining your tummy going forwards. Whereas actually if you kind of imagine your whole torso going out, you’re like an So your ribs kind of going outwards as well. That’s a really nice image. So you’re not just kind of pushing your belly out. You’re thinking of your lower ribs and your back kind of expanding as well.

Fiorenza Rossini (16:07)
Hmm.

Hannah Douglas (16:18)
It’s quite a nice image.

Fiorenza Rossini (16:19)
It’s quite helpful, I think. I will let you know how it goes.

Hannah Douglas (16:23)
I’m not sure.

Fiorenza Rossini (16:25)
Thank you for being here. I hope you’re enjoying today’s episode. If you want to hear more about this topic, join me on LinkedIn at linkedin.com/in/fiorenza-rossini

Fiorenza Rossini (16:43)
So how do you make it work right now? Are you still acting? What’s your childcare arrangement? How do you make the three things work?

Hannah Douglas (16:52)
Yeah,

I’ve been asking myself the same question. So for example, this morning, my mum has come over and she’s taken my little boy out for the morning. But normally it is just me and him. So I’ve been trying to do things like admin and social media and all of that kind of stuff for both louder and

Fiorenza Rossini (16:55)
You

Hannah Douglas (17:19)
acting, the acting side, when he’s napping or when he’s asleep. And that’s sometimes quite erratic because he’s not a very scheduled baby. So, for example, last night he didn’t actually fall asleep until 10.40pm. So, so then, you know, what do do? Oh my God, completely.

Fiorenza Rossini (17:30)
I have two like this, so yes, I hear you.

You’re too tired to do anything at that point.

Hannah Douglas (17:43)
Yeah, but in terms of sessions and things like that, either I’ve done one-to-one sessions in the evening or a Saturday when obviously my partner’s at home, or if something comes up, then he’ll either take a day off or we get one of our mums to come and help. In the first year, we were really lucky because my partner was on gardening leave.

And obviously I wasn’t doing Louder then, but I did have a few acting jobs. So John was able to hang out with Leo and he also kind of brought him to set. So Leo was involved as well. So yeah, at the moment it’s just very much when things come up, we get someone to help. But I think, yeah.

it’s tricky trying to make things work and trying to get everything done when you’re just relying on nap time all the evenings.

Fiorenza Rossini (18:27)
Yeah,

it’s a lot to juggle. And I have seen, read quite a lot on socials about actresses bringing their baby on set.

Obviously what I read was related to kind of Hollywood based actresses, but is it really a thing? are you, is it common to bring your baby and is it kind of widely accepted?

Hannah Douglas (18:48)
Yeah, do you know what? I was really pleasantly surprised because actually, so I had three filming jobs last year and all three. One of them, Leo, was actually in, like you can’t really see him, but he was in it. So he was literally on set filming with me, which was really fun. And the other one, because I finished work on a video game that’s coming out in February.

Fiorenza Rossini (19:13)
Ooh,

exciting.

Hannah Douglas (19:14)
He,

yeah, and he came to set and they actually had a tiny motion capture suit. So they put it on him and filmed him kind of, yeah, walking around in the studio in this suit. And yeah, the other one, they were so happy for John was there. That was quite more early on the first one. So John was there in the green room with Leo. And if I needed to go back, they were pretty chilled. So I think it varies. think.

you know, you’re always going to hear of situations where people aren’t as welcoming or where it’s a little bit more tricky. Obviously, filming is very time sensitive, so it can be a lot of pressure. But actually, I’ve been really pleasantly pleasantly surprised so far at how welcoming people have been. And it’s felt really nice to include him in what I’m doing. And, you know, as time goes on, it will get easier to

Fiorenza Rossini (20:02)
Hmm.

Hannah Douglas (20:05)
If I need to go away and film for a night or a couple of nights, then that will kind of become easier. But yeah, so far it’s been nice kind of being able to include him.

Fiorenza Rossini (20:14)
That’s great. That’s great. I wish it’d be so welcoming in the corporate space.

Hannah Douglas (20:20)
I know, I know,

yeah. And I don’t think it was like that before. think, yeah. I mean, I think obviously the acting industry is its own thing. So it’s very different to a corporate space. But yeah, I think now that there are a lot more female cast and directors, a lot more female producers and women behind the camera, I think it’s becoming even better.

Fiorenza Rossini (20:42)
That is great to hear. And I want to ask about when you were pregnant, how is it in the acting industry? Is it quite welcoming? some women would say in the corporate world, oh, there’s this promotion I didn’t get, there is this opportunity I didn’t get. Does that also happen in the acting industry?

Hannah Douglas (21:03)
Yes, think definitely. I think when it was early on, it was okay because obviously you can hide it. But obviously what I do is it matters what you look like. So there are certain things that I then didn’t get put up for or wouldn’t have been able to do. So I suppose potentially could have missed out.

I think the great thing that I was, cause I was doing loads of work on the video game. And actually that didn’t matter because it was, cause it was motion capture. performance capture. Actually, it didn’t matter that I had a bump because they just made it go away. My character didn’t have a bump. And it was quite weird seeing like, cause I could see my character.

sort of mapped out on a screen at the same time I was moving. And it was really weird as my bump got bigger to see, you know, in real life, the sensor would be kind of like out here. And then you look at the character and you’re like, well, it’s not there. So yeah, I think I was lucky with that job that I had because I actually was filming that. The last block I did, I think I was.

Fiorenza Rossini (21:57)
Not there.

Hannah Douglas (22:06)
39 weeks pregnant. But the director didn’t let me do any of the physical stuff. I just had to do the voice and the face, even though I actually really wanted to, but he was like, nope. Which is probably for the best.

Fiorenza Rossini (22:07)
Wow, no.

Are there ways to make the bump disappear post-prod.

Hannah Douglas (22:26)
Yeah,

in filming it happens quite a lot. And you’ll just kind of notice that someone constantly has something in front of them, like a suitcase or a folder or something like someone’s positioned really well. Yeah, they do that a lot. But I think it’s hard. If you’re not already in something. It’s hard to be cast. Yeah, it depends. Yeah, it depends. mean, I know even kind of

Fiorenza Rossini (22:42)
to be cast.

Hannah Douglas (22:48)
more famous actors had to say no to something because they would have been really pregnant at the time. So yeah, it depends. It’s one of those things where actually for the man as a male actor, that’s something they never ever have to think about. Whereas it does, it does have an impact on your career. Yeah, definitely.

Fiorenza Rossini (23:08)
And so with your acting work, you have to step into many identities. How did that change or what impact did it have on

connecting with your own identity and finding your own identity.

Hannah Douglas (23:22)
I think that one of the most brilliant things about acting is that we get the chance to see the world through somebody else’s eyes. And I think that teaches us lots of things. It teaches us about our opinions on things and it opens our eyes more. I think that’s one of the brilliant things is that you have to be empathetic and you have to be able to see things differently.

I was never interested in playing myself. I always wanted to play people who came from a different walk of life than me, because I think that’s what’s really exciting. And I think that helps us kind of understand each other. I think it’s tricky sometimes if you’re playing someone who you really don’t relate to and is quite a horrible character. That’s hard.

because you have to find something, you have to find the human element of them and the thing that you can relate to and there usually is something even in the worst, worst people, there’s usually something you can find and cling on to that makes you understand why they’re making the decisions they make. But yeah, that can be more challenging.

Fiorenza Rossini (24:26)
Yeah, yeah, I can understand that. And so you mentioned at the start of our conversation that it wasn’t, it didn’t necessarily come easy to you to be on stage and be you. Could you tell us a little bit more about that and how you found your way to be you on stage?

Hannah Douglas (24:39)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, so I think because I had spent my life like I did, I was acting when I was a kid. I was so used to being on stage or in front of the camera playing characters. And, you know, I’ve always loved playing with accents and all of this kind of stuff. So that side of things I had, I always had that confidence. And like I said, I think it was as I got older, had comments and experiences at school that…

made me feel a lot more nervous. And I think even when I went to drama school, because I was quite young, we did all this voice training and all these amazing classes. And I think even then it took me a while to fully be able to realize the power of my own voice, because I think I was frightened of becoming too much and too big.

I remember a director said something to me like, you, I think she said, you remind me of my daughter. And I feel like you’re almost frightened to be too good or too big. And I didn’t get it at the time and now I sort of get it. And I think it happens to a lot of people, but a lot of women, I think we are frightened of taking up too much space and frightened of being told that we’re.

arrogant or bossy or whatever it is, all of those words. So we really, really hold back and it can take a long time to physically be able to let loose. So I think actually, as time being an actor kind of working in the industry definitely gave me that depth and acting gave me that experience and the

the space to be able to find that in myself in terms of being a character. But I think actually in terms of finding it in myself, I think motherhood has really done that for me. I, especially having a little boy, it’s just really important to me that he knows that my voice matters, that women’s voices matter.

that his voice matters. And I really want him to see me talk without apologizing for myself. And without being frightened to be too big. I really don’t want that for him. I really want him and little girls especially to know that it’s okay to fill up the space. So yeah, I really think it’s actually not been since becoming a mother that I’ve really found that in my…

⁓ speaking as me.

Fiorenza Rossini (27:04)
This is a beautiful story. ⁓ It really changes us when we become a mom.

Hannah Douglas (27:06)
No

Fiorenza Rossini (27:11)
And so

when you got to this realization of how you wanted to show up, how you wanted to be. I mean you probably were already but this was kind of turning the volume up, I’m thinking.

What did you notice? Did you notice anything that changed in your relationship with your song?

Hannah Douglas (27:28)
Yeah, I think I’ve been much kinder to myself. think I also just in the way that I look at or think about or talk about my body as well. So not just my voice, but I think pregnancy and then becoming a mum has made me see my body completely differently. So not apologising for that.

And I think maybe also because I’m really sleep deprived, I just don’t have as much patience. So I think I’m a bit, well, this is what I think, take it or leave it. ⁓ I just don’t have the time to sit and deliberate and worry about kind of how I’m coming across. Yeah, I literally don’t have time for that. So I think it’s a little bit of that too. I’ve definitely noticed that

Fiorenza Rossini (27:57)
more straight to the point.

Yeah.

Hannah Douglas (28:15)
actually if I think something, I have more confidence in saying what I think or asking for what I want than maybe I did before.

Fiorenza Rossini (28:24)
I love that. motherhood, has made you even more confident. ⁓ And perhaps in your work in the women, in the moms that come to you, you might hear women say, actually, I’ve lost my confidence since I became a mom. What do you think that could be?

Hannah Douglas (28:28)
Yeah.

I was just going to say, think that that, in my experience, I think I’m very fortunate that I’ve had that experience. I think a lot of people do feel the opposite and I can see why, and I can see where that comes from. I think it can be a whole variation of things depending on the world that you were in work-wise before, because I think perhaps the corporate world isn’t quite as welcoming of mothers, of women.

I think it’s getting better, but I think perhaps a lot of those spaces are still not quite as welcoming. So I think women feel like then they’re not getting the chance to progress. They’re not kind of getting the chance to have their voices heard. I also think it depends on your family situation as well because…

you know, I think as much as you say before you have a baby, we’re going to make sure everything is 50 50 and really equal. It’s so difficult to do that. And I think that it’s kind of you have to have really difficult conversations with your partner and you have to really talk about that division of labor and the emotions that are tied to that. It’s a lot. And I think that there are a lot of people who

feel like things aren’t what they would like them to be, but they feel like they can’t change it. I think that can really put strain on relationships and therefore that can make you lose confidence as well. And also because we’re all different, some people, some people really want to spend all their time with their children.

And some people don’t and that’s okay. So I think it really just depends on you and all of those different aspects of your life to whether it’s going to make you feel kind of more confident in yourself or less confident because we’re just, we’re all different.

Fiorenza Rossini (30:23)
Yeah.

Yeah. No, absolutely. And when we return to work and if we decide to return to work as a parent, I feel like how much we feel

safe, to be who we are in our new identity of, know, we are a parent now. Also matters in finding, in getting our confidence back if it got a little bit wobbly during maternity leave, for example, the passing by comments that people can make, colleagues can make, our boss can make.

Hannah Douglas (30:37)
Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (30:56)
it can really have an impact because it can be such a raw time. mean, firstly, we are sleep deprived and, you know, most moms and dads when they go back to work, they’re still sleep deprived.

Hannah Douglas (31:05)
Yeah, yeah, definitely still am.

I think that the confidence is about three things. It’s about breath, permission and then choice. So it’s where your breath is sitting and being able to feel open and get that breath dropped. But then it’s having the permission to feel like you can.

say what you want to say, be who you are and not feel judged. That’s probably one of the biggest things. And then it’s the choices that you make from that once you feel kind of secure in your breath and feel safe. I think especially as mums, we get a lot of comments and you’re always being, whatever you’re doing, you’re always being made to feel like you are doing something wrong. Whether you choose to…

go back to paid work, don’t go back to paid work, whether you put your child in nursery or don’t put them in nursery, sleep situations, breastfeeding, everything, whatever you’re doing, someone will take care of you. Everybody has an opinion, even people who don’t have milk producing breasts have an opinion on breastfeeding, which is just insane. But yeah, so I think that can really make you feel

Fiorenza Rossini (32:01)
Everyone has an opinion!

Hannah Douglas (32:14)
uncertain in yourself and I often feel like I am kind of ready to like it’s almost like you’re ready to fight you’re ready to fight the It’s exhausting.

Fiorenza Rossini (32:22)
Yeah, I am too.

I have a friend who, it was last summer, she was sending me a few stories of women

who were breastfeeding on a plane and the flight attendant comes to them and they’re like, okay, someone has complained and basically they’re asked to stop breastfeeding. Those stories never happened to me, but I was ready. I was embodying the story. And then when I was next on a plane, I was like, I’m ready, come to me.

Hannah Douglas (32:50)
Thank you.

I know I’m exactly the same. This is what I would say if anyone does that to me.

Fiorenza Rossini (33:00)
My friend would say, you don’t have to say anything it’s your legal right. Yeah, but I want to fight.

Hannah Douglas (33:10)
You

want the like movie moment when you just go on to go in a monologue. ⁓

Fiorenza Rossini (33:15)
Yeah,

yeah. And they’re like, please get someone film this. No, I’m joking. So you mentioned permission. I like that. So breath permission and choice. Would you say in permission there is an internal element, but also an external element then?

Hannah Douglas (33:18)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I’m say with you.

Yeah, 100%. I mean, I think actually the biggest part is giving yourself permission. I think that’s the biggest battle. I think that the external permission is probably more about things that happened to you when you were younger. Whether that’s from family, friends, society, whatever it is, I think they can kind of really have an impact on whether we feel that permission as we grow up.

But I think the biggest element of it is actually being able to give yourself that permission.

Fiorenza Rossini (34:03)
Thank you so much, Hannah. I’ve really enjoyed our conversation. I don’t want it to stop, but…

Hannah Douglas (34:11)
But it would be a very long podcast.

Fiorenza Rossini (34:14)
much.

Hannah Douglas (34:14)
you.

thank you for having me.