Belonging Project Podcast

Fiorenza Rossini (00:52)
Today I am joined by Gemma and Sima, two women dedicated to changing the narrative around parental burnout and belonging. Gemma Dean is a life coach and the founder of Reset with Gemma, and Sima Rahman is an event manager and the creative force behind the Artist’s Apothecary. Together, they co-founded the Mindful Parent Hub, where they combine wellbeing education

with art therapy to help parents move from isolation to a true sense of belonging. Gemma, Sima, welcome to the show.

Gemma Dean (01:26)
Thank you.

Sima (01:27)
Thank you for

that lovely introduction.

Fiorenza Rossini (01:30)
What is, in your view, one perfect parent myth that you’ve personally debunked recently?

Sima (01:39)
Things like mum can’t manage everything. society and we as mums put a lot of pressure on ourselves and feel like we have so much to do, it’s endless and we’re just about surviving but we’re also

I’m not doing a great job. And then there’s that whole kind of, we’re failing, we’re failing, but in actual fact, we’re not failing. We’re doing fantastic. We just have taken on way too much and we just need to manage it better. So I would say that’s one of the things we’ve debunked in our workshops, haven’t we, Gemma?

Gemma Dean (02:10)
Yeah.

Yeah, think also

the answer, like self care is the answer to everything. It’s not, I mean, it is important. You can’t just go to the spa and have a day and that’s going to fix you. What’s important is actually doing small habits, stacking. It’s a change. There isn’t, you know, it’s not just getting a balance. It’s making those small changes into your everyday life that will help you go on for the future.

So yeah, all this talk about self care, seems like the magic fix isn’t, is actually there’s a lot more work to put in. So that’s what our workshops are all about. We try and do them on a regular basis so that there is a nice weekly meetup for parents. They’ve got something to look forward to. They do the work, they build connections with other women. You can bring your kids so it’s accessible.

Sima (03:06)
there any other myths that you think we’ve debunked Gemma?

Gemma Dean (03:10)
I think one of the myths is that we just have to do it all and we don’t have, we can ask for help. I think that we just, there is a myth that we have to just get on with it. And there is, you know, there are other options out there. That’s why we created these workshops. One of the things that when I was going through parental burnout and just having two kids,

I was in denial that I was living this perfect life being a mum and I wasn’t. So there wasn’t any support. So that’s why I think our workshops are important.

Sima (03:48)
Yeah, we don’t have to just get on with it.

Fiorenza Rossini (03:51)
I think often it is still perceived as being a weakness right? It’s being a weakness asking for help means you’re not managing or, you you haven’t it all figured out, but actually it can be a tool to support you in your own parenting journey. Yeah.

Sima (03:57)
Yeah.

Hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (04:11)
Thank you, I’m sure this will resonate, this myth will resonate with many. Right, Gemma, before we look back, perhaps we can look at where you’re now. So you’re a life coach, you’re focusing on resetting and your passion is to support parents who feel isolated and or unhappy.

Gemma Dean (04:26)
Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (04:34)
⁓ Could you tell us a little bit about what does resetting mean to you and in your work?

Gemma Dean (04:41)
So it’s about allowing space, booking that time in, whether it’s 90 minutes one-to-one coaching or a 90 minutes workshop, or even just booking some time in your own calendar on your own to do the work. Because so often we don’t have, I feel like my life sometimes is a hundred miles an hour, always looking forward, always on the go, but it’s important to stop.

and actually enjoy motherhood. we often, you know, sometimes I forget that, you know, we’re always doing these things, but we have to take a moment to enjoy these times with our children. So resetting for me, I do a lot of work with parents who feel lost after motherhood, who don’t know what their place anymore or because they’re,

Fiorenza Rossini (05:10)
Hmm.

Mm.

Gemma Dean (05:32)
their life has changed so much and their life has taken up so much with their children and their families, they have not put themselves on the list and their wants and needs are at the bottom. And unfortunately, once that happens and time takes its toll, you do become unhappy, you do lose a sense of yourself. So resetting is about booking that time in for yourself.

and whatever work you need to do to help you navigate to get from A to B, that’s the time to do it with some guidance, obviously.

Fiorenza Rossini (06:06)
And I sense there is quite some empathy here and compassion as you talk about this. And I know you’ve experienced parental burnout yourself, haven’t you? And you’ve experienced a major life tradition as well after the birth of your third child.

Gemma Dean (06:23)
Mm-hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (06:24)
For those listening, perhaps who are in the thick of it, in the thick of feeling burned out, and perhaps they don’t have the words to put on the feeling ⁓ just yet, would it be okay to share what it looked like or felt like for you?

Gemma Dean (06:35)
Thank you.

Yeah, I mean, I didn’t even know I was in parental burnout until a year and a half later. I didn’t even I had never heard of the term parental burnout until I was writing a piece for work about burnout. And I came across the term and I and I read all of the symptoms and I instantly knew that that was where I was a year and a half ago. So what did that look like for me?

I was just surviving, I was going through the motions of parenting, getting the children fed, dressed, off to school, but there was no joy, there was no happiness. I could not connect with my kids. I just wanted, sometimes, know, not a shame to say, but sometimes I just felt like running away because I had a lot of pressure on me.

There was big lifestyle change when I went through a separation. my life had dramatically changed. And I was at that time for a short time, the main sole child caregiver to my children, you know, there wasn’t a lot of support. And in the beginning, I was ashamed to ask for help or to tell anybody about my situation because of the shame really.

It took me a while to get help, how I felt in the body was numb. was, you know, I was not eating very well, not looking after myself. I was exhausted and mentally exhausted, but at night I couldn’t sleep because I had all of these anxiety, racing thoughts. So it really does show up.

in sort of every aspect of your life, but you can still continue to function, to care give your children, because like I said, I just felt like I was going through the motions. just, did the job, but this wasn’t the mother that I wanted to be.

Fiorenza Rossini (08:33)
Yeah. Yeah.

Was there a turning point? ⁓ I know you’ve mentioned you realized you were in burnout one year later. What helped you get out of it? Was there a specific turning point?

Gemma Dean (08:48)
I

knew I needed some support or help and I was looking for a counselor initially and I came across a life coach and I’d never heard of life coaching before but I seemed to something about her bio resonated with me and I booked a call and just having that first call which was very emotional and I don’t think I got anything out

Fiorenza Rossini (08:56)
you

Gemma Dean (09:14)
But knowing that I had somebody that I could speak to every week or every two weeks who guided me through the next year and a half of my life, which was going to be very tricky to navigate, lots of changes, how to look after myself. was going after I was on maternity leave at the time and then navigating how to go back to work. Knowing that I’ve got somebody

who’s going to challenge me and we can discuss all of the options. Sometimes you don’t even, when you’re in burnout, you can’t, you don’t know you’re in burnout because, you know, it’s very hard to think functionally and straight, you know, like I said, you’re just going through the motions. You want someone to sort of click your fingers and say, Hey, like, you know, how are you feeling and what’s going on?

with somebody like guiding you through and challenging you and making you look at all the options that are available, then you can start to work out the next steps, the clear decisions that you’re going to make. And it sits well with you, because you’re not doing it on your own.

Fiorenza Rossini (10:22)
Hmm. No. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it sounds like that was a bit of a healing journey, right, to have… Yeah. Yeah.

Gemma Dean (10:30)
It was, I did a lot of work on myself.

It was the hardest point in my life, but I’m so glad I’ve come through it because now I realize that I wasn’t really happy. I was living this life of denial even before I had my third. I was sort of dipping in and out of burnout, working four days a week before that. And now

one of my family values is wellbeing. For my three children, we’re all looking at how to keep healthy, making sure that mummy gets a rest, I’m making sure that I book my time in for me so that I can show up for my children and connect with them on their level.

Fiorenza Rossini (11:09)
Mm.

So there’s a system in place for you to look after yourself. Yeah. Yeah. And it’s so hard, I think, when we become parents to…

Gemma Dean (11:17)
There is the system now, yes. Yeah.

Fiorenza Rossini (11:25)
especially in the early years to prioritize ourselves, right? Because everything is about this immediate need, sometimes physical needs. There’s a hug that needs to be given. There’s, you know, tears that needs to be wiped and other things that need to be wiped. And yeah, it can be very much consuming.

And Sima, you are the creative force behind the Artist Apothecary, I love your brand name. And you’re also a big advocate for mental health and creative therapies and identity as well, right? And you’ve been open about the challenge of returning to professional life for you after…

Sima (12:05)
Hmm.

Fiorenza Rossini (12:05)
a

long career break. Could you take us a little bit back perhaps with you in that moment? How was it to experience that coming back?

Sima (12:15)
I think I was always, as a freelancer, I was always doing a bit of work. So it felt like I never completely went away or left a career or a job or went fully on mat leave. But it took me a while to kind of push myself to do more with what I was already doing and come off.

I feel like I’ve been on a break mode for so long with the kids and I wanted to give myself that time to enjoy them growing up because it goes so fast. like with the first one, I remember quite well with the second one, I feel like it went really quickly because you’ve got two and I have little regrets there when I look back at photos and I think, gosh, she was so cute, but I didn’t.

you know, inhale it all in and enjoy every second. And I think as moms, we need to be reminded to do that as well. To just enjoy and stop complaining and moaning and just enjoy that because we all regret it. But yeah, so for me coming back to work, I guess it was a gradual transition over the past three years.

And it’s been hard where you work for yourself, you do everything yourself. Every job title is you. And then you suffer with like imposter syndrome. And I feel like a lot of moms get this because you’re out of it for so long, out of that whole career kind of work mode. And then when you come back and you’re meeting new people and you’re trying to get people to believe in you, the work you do and trust in you.

It’s hard to feel like you belong back in that kind of area. But to believe in yourself first and then people can believe in you, but it’s hard to get there. So that’s been my journey. think only I’ve worked really hard the past year. End of 2024 was a bit of a pivot mode for me where I hit my forties.

And I felt like I was having a bit of a midlife crisis and questioning a lot of things about my life. I had not read about this feelings or this kind of midlife era in the forties. So it kind of hit me by surprise. And then, but I had to kind of get myself the tools to put myself through it. So 2020 before was a pivot where I had to create boundaries, make some changes.

do like a whole vision of where I want to go, where I want to be, what I need to do to get there. And it means so many different things in your life that you need to change to get there. It’s not just business side, it’s also personal things as well. And then 2025, I put that all into place. And then 2026, I’ve had a whole kind of other set of visions, which I can now put in place because I’ve…

put 2025 in place, I’ve done everything there. So that’s been my journey, I guess. I feel like it’s taken me a while to get here, but then maybe now is the right time. Maybe I’m at a place where it was meant to happen at this time.

Fiorenza Rossini (15:21)
Yeah.

And I’m getting a feeling that things are clicking for you now. It’s like they’re falling into the right, the place where they were meant to be. ⁓ Creative therapies, could you tell us a little bit about what it means? What types of intervention or therapy are we talking about and what draw you perhaps to them?

Sima (15:27)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

I have always intrinsically been a hugely creative person from every aspect of my life. I’ve been really, really creative and I didn’t realise this about myself until like late within my teens, early twenties. And I think growing up, I always felt a bit different in that sense where culturally as well, I was a bit different.

I dressed a bit different. I had like a collective bunch of different groups of friends. So it wasn’t just one set of people that I gravitated to. They were just different age groups, different backgrounds, all kinds. So it’s shaped, that’s shaped me massively as who I am as well. And probably added to my creativeness. But I’ve like been

Fiorenza Rossini (16:29)
Hmm.

Sima (16:33)
part of so many different types of project because of this creative side that I have and because it takes over everything that I do. And I guess going through the journey I’ve been through, like I was diagnosed with, after I had my children, I had a lot of trauma resurface from my childhood and I was diagnosed with childhood trauma and depression. And I wanted to beat that. I didn’t want those labels.

And I feel like creativity helped me a lot, that kind of whole journey of working on myself in a creative way. And it’s not just through art, there’s so many different aspects of being creative and living a creative life. I’ve written about it on my website, ⁓ a couple of pieces on there, just to kind of give a breakdown of how you could live that kind of artistic, creative, healing kind of life.

And where I believe in it so much through like my dad suffers from schizophrenia and he’s been on different types of medication all his life. And it’s been horrible to see the side effects. Also just kind of the feeling of him being pumped full of medication and just going through the motions.

And I truly, truly believe that when you look into alternative therapies, before you go down that kind of black hole of no return, that you can save yourself, but you have to put the work in and you have to make that decision to make that change before. Because depression, once it takes over, it’s hard to come back from it where you

can’t help yourself. So yeah, before you get there, if you feel like you need a bit of help, get that help because we all, I feel like we all need a bit of therapy and that stigma against saying, I’m getting help at the moment, I’m getting counseling or I’m talking to someone. Like that really needs to kind of be shaken off. I remember a friend,

Fiorenza Rossini (18:27)
Yeah, yeah.

Sima (18:32)
I say to yeah, yeah, I’m getting counselling. And a friend of mine said, ⁓ I’m so sorry to hear that. said, but why are you sorry? Why does it need to be a sorry issue? it’s, it’s wow, that’s amazing. You know, I’m so glad you’ve taken that step. Like well done kind of thing. That’s how it should be celebrated. Because I feel like we all need a bit of help in some way or another, whichever kind of format it’s in.

Fiorenza Rossini (18:38)
.

Gemma Dean (18:41)
negative.

Fiorenza Rossini (18:45)
Yeah.

Sima (18:58)
just to kind of keep us ticking along on the right side of sanity, know, especially in the world we live in now. Did I just digress on what we’re talking about?

Gemma Dean (19:07)
What?

Fiorenza Rossini (19:09)
No, no,

no, I think you answered the question. What types of intervention do you help people with through your work at the Artists Apothecary?

Sima (19:13)
Yeah.

So I work with people of all different age groups. I started off doing craft clubs in lockdown for kids. So one of the reasons I have a hoard of crafts and stationery and I already had an online retail shop. So I thought, why don’t I design some craft clubs, put it online and the kids who want that social interaction can buy the pack.

join on Zoom. Mind you, I doing this from my kitchen table. My kids get to have that social interaction and so do these other kids and they do it in such a creative way where the packs can then still be used again and again while they’re stuck at home with nothing else to do. And some of it was curriculum based where I was teaching at home.

Um, lot of the subjects with the kids and their dad was, he took over two areas and I took over the rest and I was, I was a class, I became a teacher basically, an unpaid teacher. Um, I couldn’t recognize myself. I was planning like classes the night before and doing timetables and schedules and all that kind of stuff. Um, so yeah, these craft clubs started and it was such a kind of great idea for lockdown.

Gemma Dean (20:23)
Mm.

Sima (20:39)
It was great for my kids, great for these other kids. When the sessions ended in lockdown, the kids who didn’t live locally, because they became afterschool clubs and the local kids joined. But the ones that couldn’t join, because we had people join from like Manchester and Bristol and stuff, and they sent me gifts in the post, like books, art books, and things like that. It was so sweet. It was really nice. And it just made me realize how much of an effect.

Gemma Dean (20:58)
I’m home.

Fiorenza Rossini (20:59)
Aww.

Sima (21:05)
things like this can have. I then wanted to do, move into like art therapy style workshops for adults, but I didn’t have the accreditation for it. So I did two levels in talking therapy so I could incorporate my art experience with the talking therapy levels that I trained in.

And with also the extensive like CBT counseling sessions that I’d had myself, I wanted to use my own healing journey and how that changed my life around to incorporate my experience in so many different aspects into these workshops. So hence how Mindful Parent Hub has come along and the other sessions that, and now I want to design them to have an online.

format so I can do modules online as well and then anyone can have access to the work that I do. But yeah, it’s such a big, like 2026 is now a whole, there’s a whole Renaissance kind of come back, trend come back. So something that I’ve been preaching about since lockdown has now become a trend.

And it’s because everything and now it just reinforces my whole ethos of artistes apothecary and everything that I do and everything that I’ve been doing the last few years of this kind of comeback. there’s less people want to use their screens less. They want to use their iPads less and use their hands to do things, whether it could be crocheting, knitting or

doing an oil painting, you know, you don’t need to have any experience either. You don’t need to be an expert in any of these things. So yeah, it’s a very powerful kind of area to be in, I feel like. it’s not, yeah, it should be recognized a lot more. yeah, there’s less, there’s also the other reason.

Fiorenza Rossini (22:50)
Yeah.

Sima (22:57)
why it’s becoming such a trend now is less and less people are going to the clubs, less and less people are drinking as well because they know it’s people are trying to be more mindful, more healthier with their lifestyles. And the lifestyle we used to have back in the day, it’s not sustainable and it’s not, we have more education around it as well now.

Clubs are also closing down, so people are looking for other things to do instead of nights out. So things like sip and paint, where you might have a glass of wine and do it, you know, and then you have people to talk to as well. Coming out of lockdown, I feel like a lot of us lost the social aspect of our life and connecting with others and connecting with others is so important for our mental health.

A lot of us lost that and we’re having to kind of retrain society and ourselves back into that. And one of the ways to do that is through art therapy and art activities, creative activities, where you do it in groups and you connect with people that you haven’t met before and you get to work in.

Fiorenza Rossini (23:58)
Mm. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah,

I love the sip and paint type of format. Yeah, joining in the group, in a group class or creative activity of some sort, where there’s a group and there’s that kind of community connection element. And also something that brings you together. Yeah, I find it quite, I mean, to me, that’s my…

Sima (24:06)
Yeah.

Mm.

Fiorenza Rossini (24:25)
self care, I guess. ⁓ But also it very much nourishes my own inspiration, my own creativity that then I can bring into my work or I can think of other stuff. Yeah.

Sima (24:26)
Yeah.

Gemma Dean (24:26)
and

Fiorenza Rossini (24:39)
Thank you for being here. I hope you’re enjoying today’s episode. If you want to hear more about this topic, join me on LinkedIn at linkedin.com/in/fiorenza-rossini .

Fiorenza Rossini (24:57)
So how did you two cross paths? Tell me about that.

Gemma Dean (25:00)
Thank

Sima (25:02)
So we, there’s something that links us here and it’s a venue in Leytonstone called Good Shepherd Studios. So Good Shepherd Studios is managed by Dani Gilbert, who is amazing. She’s fantastic. So I was running craft clubs there. did a Christmas craft club and Gemma, you were looking at

running maybe some workshops there. And Good Shepherd are great like that, like they hold focus groups to find out, not just with the locals to find out what they want, but also with people who run workshops there who are affiliated with GSS to see what they want and what they’d like to run. So after running a Christmas craft club, Dani’s feedback to me was we need more adult workshops. We have enough for…

children and adults want more workshops. So she’s like, why don’t you meet Gemma? So Gemma who’s a Leightonstone local, I’m not a local. But I just love, I love Good Sheph like the whole setup, they’ve got amazing cafe food. The building itself is a historic building, lots of history and stories to tell there. So it’s a really nice place to work, really nice community there. So then she’s like, meet Gemma and I was like,

Okay, I had no idea what to expect, what was gonna come of it. Yeah, do you know, I look back and I think, what made me even agree to meetings? No offense to Gemma, none whatsoever, but it’s not something you would normally do. Be like, meet this person and you just go meet that person, right? When you don’t know anything about them, so.

Fiorenza Rossini (26:16)
Yeah.

What brilliant setup though!

Gemma Dean (26:31)
you

Sima (26:37)
We met and automatically, I feel like we just knew what we were going to do. I don’t know how, just, it was like an epiphany that kind of just came about and kind of linked everything together. And just there and then we put the workshops, like the basis, the foundations of our workshops together.

And then we went away and we were like really excited. You know, we were throwing ideas around on our emails and thinking up names and stuff. And we’d already scheduled another meeting to finalize things. So we had another meeting and everything was designed. All the workshops were in place. And then we booked Good Shepherd Studios for our workshops and we’ve run two series and we’re running our third.

in April. So yeah, it’s worked out so well. Where I don’t think we even realised ourselves what we’d put together until we ran the workshops and realised how much of a change we were making to these parents. was one parent that came back and we did the whole series, which was fantastic. Gemma does an assessment at the beginning

Gemma Dean (27:39)
Yeah.

Fiorenza Rossini (27:43)
Amazing!

Sima (27:49)
of for each parent that books in at the beginning of the sessions, just to give people an idea where they are. And it just creates a graph of every different parts of your life and where you’re at. It gives you like a pictorial kind of view. You kind of absorb it easier and it gives you a better idea of where you’re at. So it was great for this one parent.

I mean, we’re still in touch with her today. She’s amazing. For her to come back for the first series and for the second series and to do those assessments and to see the difference in the pictorials were just amazing. And again, I did a case study on her and wrote about it on my website and it’s on the journal page so people can go have a look. And I’ve also put the graphs up of her assessments and she was more than happy for us to share that.

And then when we have our coffee catch ups, she’s always there. She’s back to kind of support us and catch up and, you know, tell us how she’s getting on, the changes she’s made. I went to an art event for one of our parents recently and there was another parent there from our sessions doing the art session. And she was like,

four of us are going around so-and-so’s house and we’re meeting up to hold ourselves accountable from what you guys have taught us. And I just thought, wow, like, this is just amazing. I love this. I love that they’ve been given the tools and they’ve taken that and they’re now using those tools to help themselves.

Fiorenza Rossini (29:08)
Hmm.

Sima (29:22)
and also even worked, they’ve met each other, they didn’t know each other beforehand, but they met each other at the group and they’ve kept in touch and they’ve become friends. And they’re now on that journey together where it hasn’t ended. What I learned through my training is when the workshops end or when counseling ends, any kind of therapy ends, is you want to do it in a way where…

Fiorenza Rossini (29:30)
Yeah.

Sima (29:44)
The person doesn’t feel like you’re abandoning them and you also need to make sure they are ready to leave you. So hence why we put the coffee catch ups in place and they’re free to attend. So anyone can come, you don’t have to be someone who’s an alumni. You can come to these sessions and meet the other parents and also just meet us and get to know us. But it gives the parents that sense of belonging with us as well.

that kind of, this isn’t the last time I’m gonna see them. I will see them again.

Gemma Dean (30:09)
to

We also have the, we started our little WhatsApp community, haven’t we? That’s growing as well, which is good.

Sima (30:18)
Yeah, we still have, yeah. which

is growing, is growing. And we want people to share their wins. We want them to share if they’re working on a project and they’re, you know, one of our parents is a musician. When she has a gig on, she share and if we can attend, we will attend. And the other artist, college artist, she…

put on workshop recently. Again, we shared and some of us attended. So we’ve got a really nice community in that sense where everyone’s there to share their own stories of what they’re going through, which has massively helped in our group settings because other parents have listened and have felt, okay, I’m not in this alone. Other people are going through this as well.

Fiorenza Rossini (30:45)
Hmm.

Sima (31:06)
There’s just so many benefits to the group sessions and to be talking, to keep talking. Yeah.

Fiorenza Rossini (31:07)
Yeah.

I’m getting

a sense that there’s a mix of coaching and peer-to-peer support that happens during the workshop. So how, in your own words, how do you describe the series that you offer through the Mindful Parent Hub?

Sima (31:16)
No.

Gemma Dean (31:25)
So last year we did, it was a 10 week series. This year we’re doing it slightly differently. We’ve broken up our 10 week series into three mini series and each mini series is three weeks. The reason we’ve done that is that 10 weeks is a big commitment for parents who have got busy lives and who may have one or more children to commit to.

But we also wanted to have a little break in between because we don’t run in term time. So and it’s difficult for parents as well when you’re in like Easter holidays to be able to do things. and also Sima and I also have our own kids to to entertain. So the series that we have, we’ve broken them into sort of three themes. The first one is called Parental Burnout to Balance. The second one is called Breaking the Cycle.

Sima (32:00)
Yeah.

Gemma Dean (32:12)
and it’s all about boundaries, setting boundaries. And then the third one is called restoring you. So look more work on yourself, setting those core values, looking at your wants and needs and yeah, finding yourself.

Sima (32:25)
finding yourself, we want

With this series in particular, we want you to have restored yourself and found yourself again, because we’ve had kids, we’ve completely lost ourselves and our self identity, who we are, because we’re not serving ourselves anymore, we’re serving little human beings. And some people are serving also,

a spouse, a partner, yeah, or parents. We had one parent in our workshop who was talking about the sandwich issue, which is you’ve got your kids yourself and then you’ve got your parents who you have to look after as well.

Gemma Dean (32:49)
parents.

deal.

Fiorenza Rossini (33:02)
That’s really inspiring work that you’re doing. And I have no doubt that it’s really having an impact on parents that are attending.

Sima (33:07)
Thank

We’ve had like doctors comment and have high praise for the session. Yeah, yeah. Which is like really kind of taken us by surprise, but also feeling quite proud by it as well.

Gemma Dean (33:16)
psychologists.

Fiorenza Rossini (33:27)
As you

should, yeah, yeah, truly amazing. I have a closing question for you both. So if a parent is listening right now and perhaps they feel like they’re on the outside kind of looking in, feeling isolated or whether there is a word that they can put on it, whether it’s burnout or something else, what is one small step that…

they could take perhaps today to start and find their way back to their sense of belonging.

Gemma Dean (33:56)
I would say if you can’t come to one of our workshops or come to a coffee catch up, would say the one step that would help you is to tell one person how you’re feeling. Putting it out there and getting that human response back, there’s nothing better than that because then you’re going to start that conversation talking through your worries, your feelings, getting the support

Sima (34:08)
Hmm, yeah.

Gemma Dean (34:22)
If you keep it all in, you’re keeping it all in the body, that stress is sitting with you, your over anxious mind or however you’re feeling, I would say just tell one person.

Sima (34:32)
Yeah, I would say that as well. At least, just at the very least, if you’re struggling to kind of do anything for yourself is to speak to that one person that you trust, that you have a safe space with. Because the last thing you need is to just to speak to anyone and then you don’t get the reaction that you really need, which then will kind of deter you from moving forward with what’s happening with you.

But yeah, have to help yourself before anything can change. And that could be speaking to someone, doing a bit of research, trying out different types of therapy or whatever you feel comfortable with, just taking that first step. All you need to do is take that first step and then be kind to yourself and be like, I took that first step. Well done you, you know? So.

Yeah, that’s really important, the first step.

Fiorenza Rossini (35:22)
Thank you so much for all the insights that you’ve shared, but also the generosity in sharing your own story. Really, really appreciate it. Thank you, Sima. Thank you, Gemma.

Sima (35:32)
Thank you, thank you Fiorenza for

Gemma Dean (35:34)
Thank you.

Sima (35:35)
this opportunity, it’s been really nice to talk to you.

Fiorenza Rossini (35:38)
And I will add to today’s episode show notes a link towards your work and I’ll include your blog post Sima on how to have a creative life. What does that look like? That’s something you touched on and I think would be a nice addition there.